Hi,
As we encountered some problems during the briefing phase which are likely caused by players grabbing equipment simultaneously, the process needs to be formalised a bit.
There are some simple rules to observe:
- Wait until all players have loaded the mission: in the players overview all of the square icons should have changed from white to dark blue/red/green/etc
-Â Perform weapon and ammunition selection by number, starting with number 1 and then going down
- Start only when the previous player has announced he is ready
- Announce clearly when weapon and ammunition selection have been completed
Weapon and equipment selection during the briefing phase is a design choice of the mission maker: it forces players to think more carefully about outfitting the unit than a selection of weapon and ammunition crates or vehicles loaded with the same available in the mission execution phase.
Players should observe good behaviour during selection as much as they should during the briefing. For example if magnifying optics are restricted to only part of the unit, it is generally a good idea to leave any binoculars available to the people with close combat optics or iron sights.
Regards,
Sander
So, is this the solution to get the armory to work? Could make sense in a strange way (if anyone understand that one).
I'll just add as a general rule the squad leader should decide which weapons to use and not to use, secondary he (or she) have the power to order players to take spesific weapons. No point carrying 4 M110 TWS if you are going CC in a city. The Leader should also consider using "mules" e.g. by ordering players to carry rockets or grenades if the mission needs it.
I agree we should wait for everyone to load mission first so that we can have a look at weapons selection. After that we should state our preferences and come to agreement who should carry what, based on individual skills, affinity, or mission demands.
But I'm sooo against weapons selection, because it is unrealistic. Too wide selection of weapons is cheat as much as respawn is. You know, where's the immersion, realism, feeling that you will have to make with what you have. Going to war ain't a shopping. Besides, sometimes too much time in briefing is wasted that way, and I know that a even larger groups of players can be more efficient in role selections and briefing process.
As soon as it will get really realistic i will quit playing this game, because we are all here to have some fun. Real War is no fun. Lets not forget this.
As Zander stated out, it is the choice of the missionmaker. Moreover what he said yesterday during the games, is a real good point aswell: Some may have the DLC Addons, some may not. Keeping at least a minimal choice of weaponselection to keep up the gameplay is a good goal here.
And: Everyone may have his personal preferences in which weaponsystems he is more practiced and some less. When just one person decides to pick you up an AT you never managed before it would be useless. Being good at this state on all weapons isnt in range either.
So i would say, the best thing is, to do as we did already: Pick your slot, select your gear one by one to avoid the crashes (maybe we will get a patch for this somedays) and: Communicate. So the leader will get an overview what guys will pick up and so he will be aware of 3 Snipers and such.
With htis it should give us the best of all: Avoid crashes and have a nice squad setup.
Cheers
 Tony
(01-03-2011, 11:46 AM)Fat Tony link Wrote:As soon as it will get really realistic i will quit playing this game, because we are all here to have some fun. Real War is no fun. Lets not forget this.
I know, but I meant immersion more than realism, playing believable scenarios. And it certainly ain't much fun losing too much time in weapons selection, specially when we are already taking too much time for briefing (this gets worse with more players attending as seen yesterday). I'm merely stating my opinion, whatever you guys decide!
sincerely,
Misha
There often will be weapons to select, and when CiA server comes up, I'm sure we'll be playing many missions from other authors as well, and they could include no weapons at all or the whole army's arsenal. Just be prepared for that. When we are going to select weapons, Zandhaas's way is perfect for that. We can speed it up once we get used to it. Crashing people's games would take too much time for sure.
Also remember that when there's no selectable weapons, players can always swap between each other. With leader's approval, of course.
Hi,
There are several considerations that can support the use of weapon and ammunition selection in a mission.
My missions can generally be carried out with the default loadouts for a squad, provided the entire unit is filled out completely. However when playing a mission with less players than the full complement of playable slots, it is possible that additional special equipment (for instance satchels) needs to be available to allow a smaller group to accomplish mission objectives. Removing the selection could render missions (near) impossible to complete for a smaller group of players.
Another reason for including a selection is to cater for players not having the DLC and offering them a chance to exchange a weapon with blurred sights for one that uses a default optic. While ACOG, Eotech and Aimpoint can be used with the BAF Lite version, the SUSAT equipped L85A2 or the BAF sniper rifles require the full version to be effective.
A final motivation to add a weapon selection is to give players the opportunity to adapt their armament to particular tactics, e.g. go for a silenced or loud approach when playing as Special Forces, or to have optics suited for either long range or close quarter battle. The latter is not entirely unrealistic, the US Army for instance making both CQB (Aimpoint) and ranged optics (ACOG) available to combat infantrymen to suit different missions such soldiers may have to undertake.
To kill the time during the briefing players are encouraged to read the provided notes or study the terrain on which the missions are to take place. It has not been unknown for players in coops to have no clue about the objectives to be achieved or the conditions to be faced. The briefing text has been typed for a reason, and required information may be spread among the different types of notes.
Regards,
Sander
I guess the problem to the weapon selection in the briefing is the character of a Listen Server.
You wont expierience those problems on a Dedicted Server.
At least i never had any on mine.
So, as far as the listen=hosting solution is just a temporary ,it is imho negligible.
If the listen server solution will remain a few weeks,I am of the same opinion as Variable yesterday in TS, to keep a weapon selection off the mission.
The discussion about weapon selection yes or no is completely irrelevant. Zandhaas's arguments are spot on and leave no room for discussion for me.
After all it it is the mission designer's choice if there are weapons available and how many - either in the briefing or in ammo crates.
If you still do not agree you are encouraged to design some missions yourself in which you can add as many or as little weapon selection options as you like (*hint* *hint*Â
).
(01-03-2011, 08:30 PM)Zwobot link Wrote:If you still do not agree you are encouraged to design some missions yourself in which you can add as many or as little weapon selection options as you like (*hint* *hint* Â ).
I already got one idea. We will play as chicken running away from a village full of starving chedaki forces in Chernarus. We must not be caught if we don't want to end up as a meal on their Christmas feast which would provide a huge moral boost to their forces in upcoming battles which will decide faith of the entire region. Use cunning, stealth and deception to escape captivity and flee to the hills where we would be safe, or, alternatively, flee south where there might be some animal rights activists among international peace keeping forces. Off course, it shouldn't be mentioned that there's no weapons selection in this mission.
Sorry, couldn't resist to write this. As I remember, animals are playable in Arma 2 but no surrealistic missions featuring them as playable came out.
Rabbits would be the best scouts ever!
The reason why there is no chicken coop mission available yet is due to the considerable risk of cheating: it is after all inherently a form of fowl play.Â
Regards,
Sander